Surrounded and Pressured

A few years ago, I was competing for a client’s business. I was one of two other advisors who were being interviewed, and I gave my traditional spiel. It turns out that one of the guys I was up against had guaranteed to the potential client that he could make 12% in the stock market.

Now, keep in mind that this was not before 2023, and even if it was, it wouldn’t matter. The advisor was using basic mutual funds and still had the audacity to claim to my client that he could net him a guaranteed 12% return.

I was in shock.

Lesson Learned: If you ever come across any type of advisor that guarantees you any rate of return, and isn’t quoting you a fixed annuity, a CD, or some type of insured bond – don’t fall for it. It’s too good to be true. Get out of their office fast.

Ugh, I'm so frustrated. I thought we were doing a good thing for ourselves, but now I think we are trapped. Full backstory: A friend recommended their "financial advisor" to us. We thought, "Great! We've been meaning to meet with someone... we have a kid on the way, and my husband isn't putting away anything toward retirement since starting his new job in August."

So, we set up a phone meeting with this friend from Northwestern Mutual. She gives us a call, and we end up speaking with her for over an hour. She asks us lots of questions—what we are looking for (we tell her we want to set up retirement stuff for my husband and explore maybe putting some of our $17k in savings into CDs or mutual funds). She asks us questions about when we see ourselves retiring, how "aggressive" we are, etc. All good stuff. We hang up and agree to talk again in a week when she will give us a plan.

Cut to a week later, we're having another phone meeting, and she emails me THE PLAN. It's many, many pages, basically explaining what we have vs. what we will need if we want to retire. But she mostly just talks about how we need more life insurance. "Sure," we think. Maybe we do need more life insurance. She explains that my husband needs at least $1 million in life insurance and I need $500k (we both already have $150k policies through work). This is news to us, but we hear her out. She also spends a ton of time explaining how we need to have disability insurance. Again, we think, "Maybe we do." So we spend the greater part of an hour and a half talking about life insurance and long-term disability insurance. She briefly mentions we should be maxing out my Roth IRA and could perhaps start one for my husband.

We hang up with plans to talk again in a week and sign some paperwork. Over the next week, my husband and I really realize that we don't want disability insurance (she quoted us paying like $170/month), and we didn't feel we needed more life insurance at this time (she had us paying $340/month in permanent and $125/month in term). But we were okay maxing out my Roth at $450/month. We also wanted to explore stocks/bonds/CDs/mutual funds more (like we initially told her). So, I sent this all to her in an email before our next meeting. She responded with, "OK, great! Sounds good... talk soon."

Cut to another phone meeting, where she would talk with us about our updated PLAN. She emails us the NEW PLAN while we're on the phone. LITERALLY NOTHING IS CHANGED. She proceeds to spend the next hour convincing us why we need life insurance and disability insurance. My husband and I are both pushovers and listen to the whole spiel again. Every time we bring up a reason why we don't feel like we need it, she tells us how wrong we are. I mean, she's the professional, we thought. I still expressed my disinterest in disability insurance but wasn't completely closing the door on life insurance. She kept guilt-tripping me about "what will your kids have if one of you dies!"

By the end of the conversation, I hadn't agreed to anything except to roll over my Roth to Northwestern. She had me give her my bank routing info to get "the paperwork started." She also said she was going to be sending me a bunch of stuff to sign in the next few weeks, but it was just to apply for things... nothing was set in stone. We could just see what the insurance company was going to quote us, and we still weren't committed to anything. "Ugh, fine," I thought. She said a small amount might be taken out of my checking, but it was just to make sure "the charges are able to go through when we start moving more money to my Roth."

So a week or two goes by, and I see a ~$30 charge go through for "disability insurance"—WHICH I TOLD HER I DIDN'T WANT! And I just realized... this doesn't feel good. It doesn't seem right. She's not listening to what we want. She still hasn't addressed our interest in CDs/mutual funds/stocks, which we initially came to her for. I spent the weekend doing my due diligence—spending a few hours on r/personalfinance, NerdWallet, just googling in general about what my husband and I should really be doing. I decided to call the whole thing off with Northwestern.

It's been a nightmare trying to cut off ties with her. I was kind and courteous through the first couple of emails and subsequent texts: "We really appreciate your time but have decided to pull out. Again, thank you." She is being evasive and manipulative, telling us we are completely wrong and still need to work with her. At this point, I have just ignored any further communication. It has just been a really bad experience.

But THE REAL REASON I still feel like I can't completely ignore her is that I asked her several times when I should expect to see a refund for the disability insurance THAT I DID NOT WANT AND DID NOT AGREE TO. She just dances around the question. I'm also worried because I've gotten a "bill" (no charges yet) in the mail for the $340/month in permanent, $125/month in term, and $170 in short-term disability.

Is there anything I can do to make sure I don't get charged for this? If I communicate with her any further, she just tries to talk to us about why we need to invest with her, etc.

WHAT DO WE DO? She is being shady AF.

My husband’s family has used a boutique firm of financial advisors for years, and honestly, they are probably the best of the best. Independent, fee-for-service—they are very good at what they do. However, I still have some massive issues with them.

Essentially, they have overcomplicated everyone’s finances to a point where the family is now reliant on them for everything. They could probably never extract themselves from their services even if they wanted to. I think this is their ultimate business model. My in-laws have a highly complex portfolio of 30-40 investments (shares, managed funds, etc.), and yet their fund grows less than my simple VAS/VGS portfolio. They pay these guys something insane like $30K per year in fees.

The same firm took on my sister as a client, despite her having extremely simple and minimal finances, charging her $5K per year for insurance and tax advice and complicating her super and other things to the point that now she can’t manage it by herself. I think they honestly should have told her she didn’t need a financial advisor.

Prior to learning about finances and “going it alone,” they had my husband involved in several managed funds that were charging him 1.5% per year and making around 5-6% before fees. Way worse than a simple ETF. I worked out that his money grew about half the amount it would have if we had just been using ETFs from the beginning. And yet, when we mentioned our change of plan, they still recommended we didn’t go with ETFs and stayed with the managed fund. It didn’t make sense.

Again, my theory is simply that they don’t charge commissions on these things, but by having them manage our money and invest into funds for us, they can charge us fees for service and keep things sufficiently complex so we need to keep using them year after year. I think it’s all a bit of a rort, really.